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And You Thought Your Last Date Was Bad

Mon, Dec 12, 2011

Memes, Pop Culture

Sometimes you have to date someone for months before the crazy comes out. And then other times, you receive a 1,600 word email after a disastrous first date that accuses you of leading the person on because you played with your hair, you made a lot of eye contact, and you said “Nice to meet you” at the end of the evening. We’re going to have to rethink our first-date advice now, because we’ve always told people that if you’re not planning on calling someone, then don’t say “I’ll call you” and never call — instead just say, at the end of the date, “It was nice to meet you,” and leave it at that. We figured that was the international standard for, “Have a nice life.” Apparently one investment banker didn’t get the memo.

Of course, this 1,600 word email could be a fake. (Backstory: “Lauren” went to the Philharmonic alone, met “Mike” there, and they went on one date, after which she didn’t return his calls, so he Googled her email address and sent her the below letter.) But we’ve received thousand of emails over the years from people who are sad/mad/heartbroken/crazy about love — and this one reads like real-life crazy to us. Here’s the letter in full — we’ll let you decide:

Hi Lauren,
I’m disappointed in you. I’m disappointed that I haven’t gotten a response to my voicemail and text messages.
FYI, I suggest that you keep in mind that emails sound more impersonal, harsher, and are easier to misinterpret than in-person or phone communication. After all, people can’t see someone’s body language or tone of voice in an email. I’m not trying to be harsh, patronizing, or insulting in this email. I’m honest and direct by nature, and I’m going to be that way in this email. By the way, I did a google search, so that’s how I came across your email.
I assume that you no longer want to go out with me. (If you do want to go out with me, then you should let me know.) I suggest that you make a sincere apology to me for giving me mixed signals. I feel led on by you.
Things that happened during our date include, but are not limited to, the following:
-You played with your hair a lot. A woman playing with her hair is a common sign of flirtation. You can even do a google search on it. When a woman plays with her hair, she is preening. I’ve never had a date where a woman played with her hair as much as you did. In addition, it didn’t look like you were playing with your hair out of nervousness.
-We had lots of eye contact during our date. On a per-minute basis, I’ve never had as much eye contact during a date as I did with you.
-You said, “It was nice to meet you.” at the end of our date. A woman could say this statement as a way to show that she isn’t interested in seeing a man again or she could mean what she said–that it was nice to meet you. The statement, by itself, is inconclusive.
-We had a nice conversation over dinner. I don’t think I’m being delusional in saying this statement.
In my opinion, leading someone on (i.e., giving mixed signals) is impolite and immature. It’s bad to do that.
Normally, I would not be asking for information if a woman and I don’t go out again after a first date. However, in our case, I’m curious because I think our date went well and that there is a lot of potential for a serious relationship. Of course, it’s difficult to predict what would happen, but I think there is a lot of potential for a serious relationship developing between us one day (or least there was before your non-response to my voicemail and text messages).
I think we should go out on a second date. In my opinion, our first date was good enough to lead to a second date.
Why am I writing you? Well, hopefully, we will go out again. Even if we don’t, I gain utility from expressing my thoughts to you. In addition, even if you don’t want to go out again, I would like to get feedback as to why you wouldn’t want to go again. Normally, I wouldn’t ask a woman for this type of feedback after a first date, but this is an exception given I think we have a lot of potential.
If you don’t want to go again, then apparently you didn’t think our first date was good enough to lead to a second date. Dating or a relationship is not a Hollywood movie. It’s good to keep that in mind. In general, I thought the date went well and was expecting that we would go out on a second date.
If you’re not interested in going out again, then I would have preferred if you hadn’t given those mixed signals. I feel led on. We have a number of things in common. I’ll name a few things: First, we’ve both very intelligent. Second, we both like classical music so much that we go to classical music performances by ourselves. In fact, the number one interest that I would want to have in common with a woman with whom I’m in a relationship is a liking of classical music. I wouldn’t be seriously involved with a woman if she didn’t like classical music. You said that you’re planning to go the NY Philharmonic more often in the future. As I said, I go to the NY Philharmonic often. You’re very busy. It would be very convenient for you to date me because we have the same interests. We already go to classical music performances by ourselves. If we go to classical music performances together, it wouldn’t take any significant additional time on your part. According to the internet, you’re 33 or 32, so, at least from my point of view, we’re a good match in terms of age. I could name more things that we have in common, but I’ll stop here. I don’t understand why you apparently don’t want to go out with me again. We have numerous things in common. I assume that you find me physically attractive. If you didn’t find me physically attractive, then it would have been irrational for you to go out with me in the first place. After all, our first date was not a blind date. You already knew what I looked like before our date. Perhaps, you’re unimpressed that I manage my family’s investments and my own investments. Perhaps, you don’t think I have a “real” job. Well, I’ve done very well as an investment manager. I’ve made my parents several millions of dollars. That’s real money. That’s not monopoly money. In my opinion, if I make real money, it’s a real job. Donald Trump’s children work for his company. Do they have “real” jobs? I think so. George Soros’s sons help manage their family investments. Do they have “real” jobs? I think so. In addition, I’m both a right-brain and left-brain man, given that I’m both an investment manager and a philosopher/writer. That’s a unique characteristic; most people aren’t like that. I’ve never been as disappointed and sad about having difficulty about getting a second date as I am with you. I’ve gone out with a lot of women in my life. (FYI, I’m not a serial dater. Sometimes, I’ve only gone out with a woman for one date.) People don’t grow on trees. I hope you appreciate the potential we have.

Read the rest of this post on SUNfiltered

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15 Responses to “And You Thought Your Last Date Was Bad”

  1. Johnny Says:

    I also think this sounds like real-life crazy.

    If Dimitri the Lover is real, why not this guy?

  2. Dannie Says:

    This is so real-life crazy, it makes me uncomfortable. Dear Lord. I would change email addresses after this and maybe move to another state. Geesh.

  3. LibrariNerd Says:

    The poor woman will probably never go to the NY Philharmonic again for fear of running into this guy.

  4. ThirtyGirl Says:

    This guy’s terrifyingly crazy. I wrote a piece on how to let a guy down gently… maybe it would’ve helped if she did #1. http://www.mythirtysense.com/2011/12/05/sorry-it’s-not-me-it’s-you/

  5. Johnny Says:

    Ha… I like that piece, thirtygirl. I can only image the annoying-to-scary spectrum of bullshit women go through to fend off unwanted suitors.

  6. Nessa Stripes Says:

    I can imagine recieving an e-mail like this one is probably a bit wow, but judging from the tone of this e-mail I think he means well. The guy just probably doesn’t understand general dating etiquette. The fact that he thinks the date was succesful because he googled the “signs”, for example.

    If anything, he comes across more socially akward than really crazy, well, to me at least.

  7. Cheryl Says:

    This is almost exactly like something my ex with Asperger’s would write. It’s very awkward, yet technical email.

  8. Delilah Says:

    Maybe this will be a lesson to all daters to say it out loud when no longer interested in the person you are dating. Some people just don’t get that ‘avoiding call thing’.

  9. Tzo Says:

    I have to agree with Cheryl and Nessa,

    This doesn’t sound crazy, it sounds like someone that is either very socially awkward, or has some sort of mental disability.

  10. Robin Says:

    Yeah – comparing this guy to a serial killer as you do by posting with that picture from American psycho is way off base. His feelings are hurt. Why wouldn’t they be? He’s polite. Quite insistent, and a bit repetitive, but not aggressive. I think at bottom he’s asking her to be accountable. Everybody has different expectations of what intimacy, is, I think, depending the culture of your nation, family, etc. I don’t think she owes him anything more than a “Sorry, if there’s been mis-communication. I didn’t feel enough to continue.” If she left it at “nice to meet you”, a lot depends on tone, and that’s subjective. But, then, I’m a sensitive guy myself, and Canadian to boot. Keeping the personal email address private ain’t a bad idea either. If he sent this to her work address, then he is out of line. Sounds like somebody could use some therapy for sure. That doesn’t make him a serial killer. …at least it sounds like he can afford a good therapist. Whether he’ll have the courage to actually GET therapy, now, that is another question.

  11. Robin Says:

    It’s also possible she’s a compulsive flirt! It’s very easy to define ourselves by whether other people find us attractive… maybe she did enjoy the attention (not enough, obviously to seek out more), and that’s what he picked up on. Sometimes both parties are wrong in a given situation. Just saying. There are people who “lead on” other people, and like he says it’s “bad” – as in misleading and possibly damaging. If he really felt something for this person, good for him for having the courage and self-respect to stand up for himself. Any more than that, and he’s headed in to harassment territory. I don’t think he crossed the line though. I’m curious to know how (if) she responded.

  12. Johnny Says:

    ^ Oh there’s no WAY she responded to that.

    Being cornered by a butt-hurt rejectee is the unsexiest thing in the world. First of all, it speaks negatively about their social calibration. They’re confrontational, ham-fisted, lacking subtlety or tact. They can’t read social cues.

    Also, it makes us feel trapped by feelings within ourselves that we’re uncomfortable with. I’m not a mean guy. I don’t want to say, “the reason I didn’t call again is because I don’t like you as much as I hoped I would, and also you’re not as pretty as in your picture.” I mean, pleasantries aside (“I just didn’t feel the chemistreeeee…), that’s what we’re thinking. Knowing how hurtful that would be to another person, I’m barely comfortable thinking it, let alone being called out on it.

    When a person blows you off, there’s a 90% chance it’s game over. If you confront them about it, it’s 110% game over. Wouldn’t you rather just move on than beat it to death?

    I agree that the guy’s probably harmless – just WAY off socially.

  13. Meow Says:

    “PEOPLE DON’T GROW ON TREES!” Hilarious.. I’d go on a second date just for the humor…

  14. Anon Says:

    This reminds me so much of my ex. I guarantee he has a personality disorder, likely narcissism.

  15. RockstarMuse Says:

    I agree with Robin, mostly. The appearance of being socially inept but willing to risk a chance at love, to accept her reasoning if so stated anything contrary to his own perceptions and beliefs.

    This is like where when cornered women come back with some lame excuse for their own lack of grace and functionality. A lack of tact isn’t always a bad thing. Who is being sensitive if he plays aggressive in his position?

    I had a chick hide in the bathroom and text me on our first date at some stinky sushi hole she chose. As soon as she said we’re not going to work out, she expressed feelings that I wasn’t acting like I wanted her. She talked about her brother’s issues and the feces on his carpet in his apartment as if we knew each other. We knew each other well enough but she also texted at the table and I corrected her. She wasn’t in the restaurant when I showed up (hiding in the bathroom) and when I left for my car, she texted me to get me back into the place only because she had friends in the parking lot who were scoping me out. When I went back she sat way in the corner of the room. Just immature garbage where I had to correct her on certain things before deleting her from Facebook and nullifying any thoughts of us being even friendly.

    Yeah, I love how women play the victim. Like they don’t stalk men. I had a stalker last year and it sucks to be beautiful.

    Yes, I’m a narcissist too.


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